Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 3:31 pm  

Saddened! wrote:

The economic climate we are in means anyone in a job should be thankful of that fact and they should be willing to compromise.

Some appear to be, some absolutely are not.

Where do you fit in? Prepared to take a real pay cut to assist the more vulnerable? Have your conditions changed so you're working longer for the same pay in a less safe environment?

Or should the only people who have to be the ones who might affect your little world?

Are the employers of the fuel drivers "all in this together" with them and having their terms and conditons altered?

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 3:52 pm  

Cronus wrote:

Given that the strike is forecast to take place at Easter and 7 day's notice is required prior to any action, my only conclusion is that people are stupid.

Personally I couldn't care less if my local petrol stations run empty. It'll be a bit of an inconvenience .....

....unless you have to drive to Cornwall over Easter on your annual rugby tour along with around 65 other families.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:03 pm  

Chris28 wrote:

Some appear to be, some absolutely are not.

Where do you fit in? Prepared to take a real pay cut to assist the more vulnerable? Have your conditions changed so you're working longer for the same pay in a less safe environment?

Or should the only people who have to be the ones who might affect your little world?

Are the employers of the fuel drivers "all in this together" with them and having their terms and conditons altered?

I'm an office worker, so there is no real H&S argument, but I've had a £10k pay cut through moving location, job role and having allowances and benefits cut. But I was in a position to see the company didn't have much choice, so I took it rather than be out of work. A mate who refused on principle and was made redundant (which equated to two months salary) has now been out of work for 10 months. It's not a nice environment in which to be unemployed at the moment and those in work need to be realistic about that. If there are issues with these companies, it should be discussed and there is action you can take that doesn't involve paralysing the country, but Unions aren't interested as it's not as much fun for them.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:11 pm  

Saddened! wrote:

I'm an office worker, so there is no real H&S argument, but I've had a £10k pay cut through moving location, job role and having allowances and benefits cut. But I was in a position to see the company didn't have much choice, so I took it rather than be out of work. A mate who refused on principle and was made redundant (which equated to two months salary) has now been out of work for 10 months. It's not a nice environment in which to be unemployed at the moment and those in work need to be realistic about that. If there are issues with these companies, it should be discussed and there is action you can take that doesn't involve paralysing the country, but Unions aren't interested as it's not as much fun for them.

You don't seem to have noticed Cod'ead's response to your earlier rant - this dispute isn't about pay bargaining, as far as I know they aren't asking for any more money at all and there is no "deal" as you intimated earlier, its about H&S and increasing pressures on drivers to fit more and more work into the same number of hours.

Thats the thing with HGV drivers, there is a clearly defined limit to the hours that they can drive, so assuming that an employer is flogging them to the limit each day there is only one other way to make them produce more - make more deliveries, and there is only one way to make more deliveries - be faster at the point of delivery or drive faster to get there.

Now think about how you would achieve that when you're driving a truck full of petrol.

Thats what the dispute is about.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:13 pm  

Seriously though, public support for tanker drivers will evaporate faster than the volatile hydrocarbons they transport if they actually strike. I suspect there will be non of the bollo*k$ we saw during the last fuel dispute where 2 taxi drivers were all that was required to "blockade" an entire refinary while the police looked on completely "helpless" - now we all know what would have happened if they had been miners don't we? All that will happen is that a lot of ordinary people will get shafted while supplies are "prioritised".

Get around the table and get it sorted, currently the government look like the t00ls. Let's keep it that way.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:13 pm  

Saddened! wrote:

I'm an office worker, so there is no real H&S argument, but I've had a £10k pay cut through moving location, job role and having allowances and benefits cut. But I was in a position to see the company didn't have much choice, so I took it rather than be out of work. A mate who refused on principle and was made redundant (which equated to two months salary) has now been out of work for 10 months. It's not a nice environment in which to be unemployed at the moment and those in work need to be realistic about that. If there are issues with these companies, it should be discussed and there is action you can take that doesn't involve paralysing the country, but Unions aren't interested as it's not as much fun for them.

I'm sure the various shop stewards and union leaders are sat round a table now gleefully discussing bringing the country to a standstill.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:15 pm  

Just for those too young to remember, this is what happens when one tanker full of explosive liquid/gas explodes on a roadside.

Just for those too young to remember, this is what happens when one tanker full of explosive liquid/gas explodes on a roadside.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 4:49 pm  

McLaren_Field wrote: Just for those too young to remember, this is what happens when one tanker full of explosive liquid/gas explodes on a roadside. Obviously not on the scale of the above but there have also been increasing indidences of mis-fuelling at forecourts over recent years, where delivery drivers have pumped diesel into gasoline tanks and vice versa. It can be an expensive mistake in terms of potential engine damage but there's also the problem of adding a volatile fuel to a relatively benign one. You need a burning torch to get diesel to catch but add gasoline in the right ratio (70/30 gas to DERV is about right) and you've got the potential for some serious fireworks. The Los Alfaques disaster involved LPG and many forecourts also dispense this fuel. The problem with LPG is that it's heavier than air and it will always run downhill or seep into drains and could manifest itself miles away from the original problem. IIRC (from my Hazchem training in the mid-70s) there was a disaster involving a crashed LPG tanker and a Scottish primary school.

McLaren_Field wrote: Just for those too young to remember, this is what happens when one tanker full of explosive liquid/gas explodes on a roadside. Obviously not on the scale of the above but there have also been increasing indidences of mis-fuelling at forecourts over recent years, where delivery drivers have pumped diesel into gasoline tanks and vice versa. It can be an expensive mistake in terms of potential engine damage but there's also the problem of adding a volatile fuel to a relatively benign one. You need a burning torch to get diesel to catch but add gasoline in the right ratio (70/30 gas to DERV is about right) and you've got the potential for some serious fireworks. The Los Alfaques disaster involved LPG and many forecourts also dispense this fuel. The problem with LPG is that it's heavier than air and it will always run downhill or seep into drains and could manifest itself miles away from the original problem. IIRC (from my Hazchem training in the mid-70s) there was a disaster involving a crashed LPG tanker and a Scottish primary school.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:06 pm  

DHM wrote:

....unless you have to drive to Cornwall over Easter on your annual rugby tour along with around 65 other families.

Hence the word 'personally' preceding my statement.

It'll be a right old pain in the arris and damaging for a lot of people but personally speaking, a week minimising petrol use won't hurt.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:25 pm  

http://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2012- ... s-of-fuel/ Caught my eye.

http://www.itv.com/news/tyne-tees/2012- ... s-of-fuel/ Caught my eye.