Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:16 pm  

When do we close the border ?

I am heading North of it when we do

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:28 pm  

Ian P wrote:

When do we close the border ?

I am heading North of it when we do

Immigration is a very relevant point.

if for example Scotland did manage to make a success of it and it was a more prosperous country than England, it's a fair bet that it will be a lot more prosperous than areas around Tyneside/Teeside/Cumbria/Humberside so what's to stop a load of northern English unemployed going north of the border to look for work.

Scotland only has a population of 5.6 million and there are 14.5 million in northern England so Scotland could easily end up receiving large numbers of migrants proportionate to its population and they could end up absorbing unemployment from northern England.

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:29 pm  

Ian P wrote:

When do we close the border ?

I am heading North of it when we do

You could "take the Black" and become a member of the Night's Watch, Guarding The Wall. Hull could become Winterfell

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:33 pm  

ROBINSON wrote:

Meh.

People who are pro-Europe would say all that. The rest of us disagree, so best not to get into it really. It's Friday, and I can't be bothered.

"People who are pro-Europe" ...or, in my case, a person who has actually taken the trouble to find out and, in the process has gone from voting "No" in 1976 to being pro_Europe now.

Most of my reply was facts and one doesn't have to be pro-Europe to recognise facts.

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 4:58 pm  

ROBINSON wrote:

... People who are pro-Europe would say all that. The rest of us ...

Out of interest, which continent do you think we're part of?

Are we Asian, for instance? What about North American – or even South American?

[Mild Rover]

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 5:28 pm  

cod'ead wrote:

You could "take the Black" and become a member of the Night's Watch, Guarding The Wall. Hull could become Winterfell

Even I have to admit that Westeros is much better than Essos, btw.

[DaveO]

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 6:29 pm  

Mild Rover wrote:

While it was obviously a more acrimonious parting, Ireland hasn't come 'crawling back' and I doubt Scotland would either.

It'd mean a Conservative government in England, Wales and Northern Ireland for the foreseable, I'd assume.

Ireland should be a sobering thought for any pro Scottish Independence people as Ireland have basically lost economic sovereignty due to the current crisis. The price for being bailed out is a bunch of unelected official telling them how to run their economy.

Add to the fact that joining the Euro (which Scotland would have to do) means agreeing to the budget controls of the Eurozone so no more deficit than 3% of GDP (I am sure from what I read the Scots run a higher one to fund their free uni education etc) they are ceding control from day one.

As to a Conservative government in England for the foreseeable future, no it would not mean that. Politics would quickly realign and as in 1997 a decade of incompetence will always ensure any government gets the boot.

It is not going to happen overnight anyway if it ever does so there is plenty of time for things to change politically in the rest of the UK.

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Fri Jan 13, 2012 7:27 pm  

maybe any Scots with ideas of abandoning the Union should read

maybe any Scots with ideas of abandoning the Union should read

[Mild Rover]

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Sat Jan 14, 2012 9:47 am  

DaveO wrote:

Ireland should be a sobering thought for any pro Scottish Independence people as Ireland have basically lost economic sovereignty due to the current crisis. The price for being bailed out is a bunch of unelected official telling them how to run their economy.

Add to the fact that joining the Euro (which Scotland would have to do) means agreeing to the budget controls of the Eurozone so no more deficit than 3% of GDP (I am sure from what I read the Scots run a higher one to fund their free uni education etc) they are ceding control from day one.

As to a Conservative government in England for the foreseeable future, no it would not mean that. Politics would quickly realign and as in 1997 a decade of incompetence will always ensure any government gets the boot.

It is not going to happen overnight anyway if it ever does so there is plenty of time for things to change politically in the rest of the UK.

Bad stuff will happen, but it can happen as part of the UK too. See 1976. It wouldn't be ceding control, so much as moving it - if London is seen as as foreign as Brussels.
It'd take away the psychological crutch of blaming the neighbours - a bit like the England's sometimes resentful attitude to the EU. In both cases, my opinion is 'together we're stronger' and that globalization requires a more internationalist outlook.
English politics would re-align to the right - my analysis was a bit facile, on reflection.
If, in theory at least, Scotland is an equal partner in the Union, do the consequences of it becoming a 'new' country, not also apply to the new UK?
If Belgium split, I'd expect both parts to be treated equally by the EU.

I hope, on balance, that it doesn't happen, but I get the impression from some of this thread that there isn't a massive amount of respect for Scotland. A union of any type needs mutual respect.

Re: Can Salmond net it? : Sat Jan 14, 2012 1:29 pm  

Mintball wrote:

Out of interest, which continent do you think we're part of?

Are we Asian, for instance? What about North American – or even South American?

Mintball. You're not stupid. So, please don't try and make out that I'm talking about a geographical continent, when you KNOW I'm talking about political union.

OK?