Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:25 pm  

rumpelstiltskin wrote:

Wouldn't have thought there was much poverty in Horsforth Gerry. I'm sure your Christmas golfing socks were of the finest merino wool!

Don't know, I neither live in Horsforth nor play golf.



I'd be ace on "Whats My Line".

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:31 pm  

Dally wrote:

The austerity looks like it is working. The UK economy is now predicted to overtake Germany as Europe's strongest by 2030 and predicted to have the second highest highest growth, after the USA, of any advanced economy.

Did you actualyy read the report or just the headline?

Few commentators have mentioned the population growth required to achieve the projected economic success, a growth that can only be achieved through a massive increase in migrant labour

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 4:38 pm  

Low taxes also cited.

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 5:11 pm  

Ajw71 wrote:

Low taxes also cited.

They will appear mid 2014 as a selling point.

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 5:41 pm  

Lord Elpers wrote:

NO MORE ARGUMENTS: AUSTERITY IS WORKING!

Labour and the chattering classes accused George Osborne of condemning Britain to a future without growth. They have been proved wrong.

The death of Nelson Mandela meant the reporting of the autumn statement was overshadowed last week but Osborne scored a significant victory over Ed Balls-Up and his critics are on the run. As the economics editor of the Sundays Times put it “The intellectual battle is over. This may not be the best or most balanced recovery on record but it is a recovery, and is gaining strength”

Even The Guardian declared that Balls was the biggest loser from Osborne’s autumn statement. Recent rapid footwork from Miliband and Balls to shift their attacks on the government from austerity to living standards, could not cover his embarrassment. Balls had endured a n autumn statement from Osborne that started with the line “Britain’s economic plan is working” and proceeded to twist the knife deep into Labour.

The coalition had inherited a country in serious fiscal crisis with its public finances “broken” and mired in “deep-seated problems of unsustainable spending, uncompetitive taxes and unreformed public services” Osborne said.

Having resisted huge pressure to abandon his deficit cutting strategy, most notably from Balls, the chancellor was able to wallow in satisfaction. Not only had Labour – and Balls – opposed every measure to reduce the deficit, but they constantly warned that without temporary tax cuts or spending increases, the economy would “flatline”

Yet growth has returned dramatically this year. Fears of a “triple-dip” recession at the start of the year proved groundless and the earlier double-dip at the end of 2011 and 2012 was revised away by the official statisticians.

Last Thursday was the biggest upward revision of growth in an official forecast for 14 years. The OBR more than doubled its estimate for this year on the back of quarterly growth rates of 0.4%, 0.7% and 0.8% respectively.

Even more than the GDP numbers the growth in jobs has defied the gloomsters. According to the OBR employment has risen by 400,000 this year, taking the total since May 2010 to almost 1 million. Over the period 2011-2019, the OBR predicts 3,1m extra jobs, three times as many as the 1,1m public sector jobs that will be cut.

All this has come without Osborne abandoning his austerity programme. In comments aimed at the Labour front bench and his many other critics he said “Over the last three years we have stuck to our guns, worked through the plan. We have done so in the face of a sovereign debt crisis abroad. We have held our nerve while those who predicted there would be no growth until we turned the spending taps back on have been proved comprehensively wrong”

The faces of the Labour front bench said it all "Bad news........there's good news"

Source: David Smith economics editor of the ST

The so called economists of the mainstream media are thick - just like you.

"George Osborne likes to say that the UK government’s cost of borrowing (the yield on gilts – government IOUs) is low because investors are impressed with his running of the economy.

This is complete and utter tripe.

Gilt yields are low because the Bank of England now owns about a third of the entire market. If the Bank was to try to even think of offloading these bonds, or even to stop buying gilts, we’d soon see how impressed investors are with Osborne’s governance.

In short, the UK is a ‘zombie’ economy. From top to bottom, it’s being kept on life support by low interest rates".

Source: John Stepek, Money Week

In short:-

As soon as interest rates go up we are finished.

As soon as foreign investors move away from the pound we are finished.

This is only a matter of time.

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:29 pm  

Mintball wrote:

So, you cannot answer the question?

You're the one stating that anyone who dares to empathise with others and even mention fairness should not do so once earning a certain amount of money.

This 'argument' has previously been shown (not by me) to be crass: to follow your logic, only a slave would oppose slavery, was an example that was given.

Yet you persist and, since you've repeatedly suggested this, you must have thought out what that rate would be.

Incidentally: I am quite comfortable now. It has not been the case for the bulk of my working life – as mentioned before, the copper jar was essential not that many years ago. No holidays, no trips out etc etc – and that was while working.

I'd be interested to know just why you'd expect anyone to suddenly only interested in themselves when their own lives improve. But then again, you can't even put a figure to your own pet theory that a concern for fairness should cease on reaching a certain pay level.

I equally doubt that you know the pay levels of anyone on here who you would assert should stop being concerned about fairness, thus rather rendering your comments insubstantial at best.

I know that I have mentioned The Spirit Level more than once on here, so either you've missed it, forgotten it or decided to ignore it.

Feel free to refute the work that Wilkinson and Pickett did – using evidence – but stop trying to pretend that such evidence does not exist.

What are you on about - or what are you on?

When people are struggling it takes all their energy and will to keep their head above water, they are shopping in a supermarket because that is all they can afford. Their not too bothered whether the multiple offers one type of apple or ten as long as the price is within their means. It is only when we reach a certain level/status/position which will be unaffected by their change in view - that they are to consider the wider perspective. Simple Maslow really. Look in the mirror you are that person. How much of your hard earned salary would/have you be/been prepared to give up so somebody down the chain of command could have more?

We are basically animals with animal instincts - our behaviour is similar to what you see in the jungle. One of the reasons meritocracy/capitalism works is because it appeals to our inbuilt instincts - the best hunter will have the most food, best choice of mate etc.

I don't need to know what you earn to know you are comfortable - you expose your whole existence and status in the posts on this very board. You wonder why I have little truck with your position? Your biggest worry is whether the local butcher will have twenty different cuts of Beef available and whether it is organic? You think somebody on minimum wage gives a poop about whether their food is organic as long as they have some. You are a hypocrite of the highest order. You talk the talk but you certainly will never walk the walk.

I don't need to put a figure on when you become less egocentric - it depends on individual circumstances. You cannot quantify it.

Again you produce one piece of work and suggest it is irrefutable proof? I take you have read Christopher Snowden's book that complete dismantles this theory? Who is right who is wrong?

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:36 pm  

General Zod. wrote:

The so called economists of the mainstream media are thick - just like you.

"George Osborne likes to say that the UK government’s cost of borrowing (the yield on gilts – government IOUs) is low because investors are impressed with his running of the economy.

This is complete and utter tripe.

Gilt yields are low because the Bank of England now owns about a third of the entire market. If the Bank was to try to even think of offloading these bonds, or even to stop buying gilts, we’d soon see how impressed investors are with Osborne’s governance.

In short, the UK is a ‘zombie’ economy. From top to bottom, it’s being kept on life support by low interest rates".

Source: John Stepek, Money Week

In short:-

As soon as interest rates go up we are finished.

As soon as foreign investors move away from the pound we are finished.

This is only a matter of time.

if interest rates rise will investors not buy in to the pound?

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 6:37 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

What are you on about - or what are you on?

When people are struggling it takes all their energy and will to keep their head above water, they are shopping in a supermarket because that is all they can afford. Their not too bothered whether the multiple offers one type of apple or ten as long as the price is within their means. It is only when we reach a certain level/status/position which will be unaffected by their change in view - that they are to consider the wider perspective. Simple Maslow really. Look in the mirror you are that person. How much of your hard earned salary would/have you be/been prepared to give up so somebody down the chain of command could have more?

We are basically animals with animal instincts - our behaviour is similar to what you see in the jungle. One of the reasons meritocracy/capitalism works is because it appeals to our inbuilt instincts - the best hunter will have the most food, best choice of mate etc.

I don't need to know what you earn to know you are comfortable - you expose your whole existence and status in the posts on this very board. You wonder why I have little truck with your position? Your biggest worry is whether the local butcher will have twenty different cuts of Beef available and whether it is organic? You think somebody on minimum wage gives a poop about whether their food is organic as long as they have some. You are a hypocrite of the highest order. You talk the talk but you certainly will never walk the walk.

I don't need to put a figure on when you become less egocentric - it depends on individual circumstances. You cannot quantify it.

Again you produce one piece of work and suggest it is irrefutable proof? Why because a few trendy lefties have told you so? I take you have read Christopher Snowden's book that complete dismantles this theory? Who is right who is wrong?

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 7:30 pm  

Sal Paradise wrote:

What are you on about - or what are you on?

Planet Earth.

Sal Paradise wrote:

When people are struggling it takes all their energy and will to keep their head above water, they are shopping in a supermarket because that is all they can afford. Their not too bothered whether the multiple offers one type of apple or ten as long as the price is within their means. It is only when we reach a certain level/status/position which will be unaffected by their change in view - that they are to consider the wider perspective. Simple Maslow really. Look in the mirror you are that person. How much of your hard earned salary would/have you be/been prepared to give up so somebody down the chain of command could have more?[./quote]

What the fücking hell are you on?

Who the f*** mentioned supermarkets? I didn't.

Sal Paradise wrote:

... We are basically animals with animal instincts - our behaviour is similar to what you see in the jungle. One of the reasons meritocracy/capitalism works is because it appeals to our inbuilt instincts - the best hunter will have the most food, best choice of mate etc...

Again, you're spouting bøolløcks instead of answers to the questions.

Sal Paradise wrote:

I don't need to know what you earn to know you are comfortable - you expose your whole existence and status in the posts on this very board....

Oh wowser! I'm so horrified! Sal "Real World" Paradise 'thinks' (I use the word generously) he knows something.

Sal Paradise wrote:

... You wonder why I have little truck with your position? Your biggest worry is whether the local butcher will have twenty different cuts of Beef available and whether it is organic? You think somebody on minimum wage gives a poop about whether their food is organic as long as they have some. You are a hypocrite of the highest order. You talk the talk but you certainly will never walk the walk...

Carry on inventing things, sunshine, because I have never suggested this anywhere. You're a fantasist, who needs your fantasies in order to provide some sort of 'evidence' for your claims.

Now if you want to stop looking like an idiot, feel free – and answer questions and provide real, meaningful evidence to support your claims.

Otherwise, you're just another little troll with nit an ounce.

Actually I suspect not: I think you're probably just a greedy, selfish individual who is trying to excuse not having an ounce of morality in their body.

Re: No More Arguments: Austerity is Working! : Sat Dec 28, 2013 8:20 pm  

Mintball wrote:

Planet Earth.

Carry on inventing things, sunshine, because I have never suggested this anywhere. You're a fantasist, who needs your fantasies in order to provide some sort of 'evidence' for your claims.

Now if you want to stop looking like an idiot, feel free – and answer questions and provide real, meaningful evidence to support your claims.

Otherwise, you're just another little troll with nit an ounce.

Actually I suspect not: I think you're probably just a greedy, selfish individual who is trying to excuse not having an ounce of morality in their body.

So, once again your "evidence" is petty personal abuse - to a guy who wrote simple common-sense stuff. You like to talk about "debate" but do you ever when people question your views?