Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 7:15 am  

Steph Curry wrote:

Lmao. Kier starmer has been found breaking lock down rules today. I look forward to the usual Labour fan boys saying either

1. Lying and say he hasn’t..or...
2. Whataboutery

3. The above poster accepting he's a humongous bellend.

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 7:59 am  

Didn't read past the first page when people were surprised about any politician lying.

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 8:37 am  

The Ghost of '99 wrote:

I don't know how you've done it but you've conflated "wokeness" (whatever that is but it appears to involve right wing folk getting upset about people being nice to other people) with substantive policy issues. The first is a distraction from discussing the second for which there are a multitude of huge issues from the past decade of failure.

If you are Labour it is easy to suggest all the problems in the NHS are to do with funding - in reality its a combination of issues - waste in the NHS is huge but it isn't nice to say it. Could the NHS have done much better during the pandemic of course it could but it is not great to suggest so.

Could the kids have been better serviced by their schools during the closure of course they could have but to say that would upset the unions and your supporter base.

Much easier to focus on sleaze/trans issues - sadly most people care much more about getting their cataracts done and the their kids getting a decent education - addressing these challenges would upset their funders. Perhaps if Labour didn't dilly dally around these subjects their stock might rise. Suggesting a 12% pay increase in the NHS - the vast majority of which did less work than normal is - to say the least - barmy.

[Mild Rover]

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 9:09 am  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

If you are Labour it is easy to suggest all the problems in the NHS are to do with funding - in reality its a combination of issues - waste in the NHS is huge but it isn't nice to say it. Could the NHS have done much better during the pandemic of course it could but it is not great to suggest so.

Could the kids have been better serviced by their schools during the closure of course they could have but to say that would upset the unions and your supporter base.

Much easier to focus on sleaze/trans issues - sadly most people care much more about getting their cataracts done and the their kids getting a decent education - addressing these challenges would upset their funders. Perhaps if Labour didn't dilly dally around these subjects their stock might rise. Suggesting a 12% pay increase in the NHS - the vast majority of which did less work than normal is - to say the least - barmy.

In what ways, specifically, could the NHS have done better during the pandemic given the politicians’ decisions (which were difficult, I admit)? I’m sure there are some, but I’d be interested to hear what you think they are. You talk about waste in the NHS but it is probably on of the most efficient healthcare delivery systems (for the funding receives), in the world. It is threadbare now in places, but after years of austerity what would you expect? The idea that most NHS staff did less work during the pandemic - what is the basis for your assertion? It doesn’t chime with the first hand accounts I have had from healthcare professionals across different areas of medicine.

Have trans issues been heavily emphasised in Labour policies, press releases or campaign materials lately? It hasn’t regularly been a focus at PMQs, for example. Sleaze has, and it has been an easy target, I agree. Sometimes easy is effective though - it was much easier for Johnson to ride nationalist populism into number 10 than it would have been to come up with a coherent set of policies to attempt to address the underlying frustrations that prompted so many people to want change. It’s not like Johnson built his electoral success on better delivery of healthcare or education. Flags, lies and whining worked. Labour maybe needs a dash of that cynicism, but too much and what is the point?

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 11:51 am  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

NHS - the vast majority of which did less work than normal

How do you know this? What were they doing instead? Where are these baseless assertions coming from?

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 5:25 pm  

King Street Cat wrote:

How do you know this? What were they doing instead? Where are these baseless assertions coming from?

He doesn't
They were working
Thin air to fit his narrative

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 8:40 pm  

King Street Cat wrote:

How do you know this? What were they doing instead? Where are these baseless assertions coming from?

Has the waiting list for appointments and operations not grown significantly??

Now I have no idea what they were/are doing instead, but from personal experience

- a relative with cancer having his appointments/scans/treatment put off until you literally have to beg for scans and the appointment date with the consultant to be met
- to then have a scan 4 weeks prior to the appointment, then arrive at the appointment to be told by a registrar (consultant in a meeting, despite it being his normal clinic time) that the scans haven’t yet been read and someone will phone us but couldn’t say when

GP’s no longer undertaking face to face appointments without a telephone consultation first - and whilst giving a day can’t say at what point during that day they will phone. Indeed the wife’s GP surgery still has locked doors so you can’t get to reception, forms handed out through windows and any face to face appointments through a side door

Tough times for NHS workers no doubt, and especially critical care - but rest of it not covered itself in glory in my experience

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 8:42 pm  

Jukesays wrote:

He doesn't
They were working
Thin air to fit his narrative

Aye were working - just like teachers

[Mild Rover]

Re: Kier Starmer : Mon May 03, 2021 10:08 pm  

ColD wrote:

Has the waiting list for appointments and operations not grown significantly??

Now I have no idea what they were/are doing instead, but from personal experience

- a relative with cancer having his appointments/scans/treatment put off until you literally have to beg for scans and the appointment date with the consultant to be met
- to then have a scan 4 weeks prior to the appointment, then arrive at the appointment to be told by a registrar (consultant in a meeting, despite it being his normal clinic time) that the scans haven’t yet been read and someone will phone us but couldn’t say when

GP’s no longer undertaking face to face appointments without a telephone consultation first - and whilst giving a day can’t say at what point during that day they will phone. Indeed the wife’s GP surgery still has locked doors so you can’t get to reception, forms handed out through windows and any face to face appointments through a side door

Tough times for NHS workers no doubt, and especially critical care - but rest of it not covered itself in glory in my experience

It is sad, a tragedy in fact, but they had to prioritise. Which meant other things were de-prioritised - because the resource to cope with what had happened and everything as else as well doesn’t exist. It wasn’t that the oncologists weren’t working, for example, it was that many of them were assigned to managing patients with COVID-19 instead of carrying out their normal practice.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue May 04, 2021 6:57 am  

Mild Rover wrote:

It is sad, a tragedy in fact, but they had to prioritise. Which meant other things were de-prioritised - because the resource to cope with what had happened and everything as else as well doesn’t exist. It wasn’t that the oncologists weren’t working, for example, it was that many of them were assigned to managing patients with COVID-19 instead of carrying out their normal practice.

Dont make excuses for them
Theyre all just excessive waste, sat on their backsides at home, hiding behind unions because their lazy.
Slag them off without any knowledge of what goes on day to day just to fit a twisted narrative