Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 9:52 am  

I'm loving the idea of a network of underground fuel pipelines. For comparison, water pipelines cost around 1M per 100m and that's not in particularly urban areas. Now think of how frequently they leak and of the costs involved in putting in a suitable specification pipe to supply petrol to a dozen or so outlets in every town and city across the UK. Based on that I think tanker drivers are safe in their jobs for now.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 10:09 am  

Keith wrote:

I'm loving the idea of a network of underground fuel pipelines. For comparison, water pipelines cost around 1M per 100m and that's not in particularly urban areas. Now think of how frequently they leak and of the costs involved in putting in a suitable specification pipe to supply petrol to a dozen or so outlets in every town and city across the UK. Based on that I think tanker drivers are safe in their jobs for now.

Coming soon to a town near you, courtesy of Sal Paradise Civil & Pipeline Engineering

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:28 am  

We had a burst water pipe up our street two weeks ago and it ran for hours before Yorkshire Water turned up.

I'd have been straight down to B&Q for their entire stock of buckets if it had been petrol that was leaking out - problem is, would it have been diesel, unleaded or premium unleaded that I was scooping up out of the gutter ?

Just my luck it would have been bloody diesel and no use to me at all.

[John_D]

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 11:48 am  

McLaren_Field wrote:

I'd have been straight down to B&Q for their entire stock of buckets if it had been petrol that was leaking out - problem is, would it have been diesel, unleaded or premium unleaded that I was scooping up out of the gutter ?

Simple way of finding out: take a match to it. If it burns your eyebrows off - petrol (flammable, you see). If the match fizzles out - diesel (not flammable).

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:18 pm  

You might be suprised by the extent that pipelines are already used in the UK to transport fuel. OK, it's predominantly primary distribution (refinery to storage site) rather than secondary distribution (storage to retail), however it is a huge volume. Look at the UK Petroleum Industry Association website for details: http://www.ukpia.com/industry_information/distribution.aspx Here's the map of the main existing pipelines: http://www.ukpia.com/Libraries/Download/UK_map_of_refineries_and_terminals.sflb.ashx I'm pretty close to this dispute - my department manages the secondary distibution of approx. 150 million litres of fuel each week to our forecourts. Whilst I'm not involved on a day to day basis with fuel (I manage our rail network), I have been more involved in the last couple of weeks: trust me when I say that H&S is NOT the main reason for this potential industrial action.

You might be suprised by the extent that pipelines are already used in the UK to transport fuel. OK, it's predominantly primary distribution (refinery to storage site) rather than secondary distribution (storage to retail), however it is a huge volume. Look at the UK Petroleum Industry Association website for details: http://www.ukpia.com/industry_information/distribution.aspx Here's the map of the main existing pipelines: http://www.ukpia.com/Libraries/Download/UK_map_of_refineries_and_terminals.sflb.ashx I'm pretty close to this dispute - my department manages the secondary distibution of approx. 150 million litres of fuel each week to our forecourts. Whilst I'm not involved on a day to day basis with fuel (I manage our rail network), I have been more involved in the last couple of weeks: trust me when I say that H&S is NOT the main reason for this potential industrial action.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:34 pm  

Man in Madrid wrote:

I'm pretty close to this dispute - my department manages the secondary distibution of approx. 150 million litres of fuel each week to our forecourts. Whilst I'm not involved on a day to day basis with fuel (I manage our rail network), I have been more involved in the last couple of weeks: trust me when I say that H&S is NOT the main reason for this potential industrial action.

There are lots of other people who are 'pretty close' to the dispute who say it is the main reason. What unique insight can you offer to convince us to trust you over all those other people?

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 2:43 pm  

Rock God X wrote:

There are lots of other people who are 'pretty close' to the dispute who say it is the main reason. What unique insight can you offer to convince us to trust you over all those other people?

H&S doesn't get your average man to strike. It is just a PR exercise in trumpeting up minor concerns because they make better soundbites than the real reasons behind the strikes.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 3:02 pm  

Man in Madrid wrote:

I have been more involved in the last couple of weeks: trust me when I say that H&S is NOT the main reason for this potential industrial action.

I believe the primary objection is the continued erosion of employee terms & conditions as each new contract has been awarded. If you think this would not have any concomitant effect on H&S, then I believe you're wrong.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 3:04 pm  

Rock God X wrote:

There are lots of other people who are 'pretty close' to the dispute who say it is the main reason. What unique insight can you offer to convince us to trust you over all those other people?

You've caught me out. I'm not "pretty close". I lied. I don't work for a retailer who sells >150 million litres of fuel each week. I wasn't involved in the decision making and re-tendering process of the largest secondary fuel distribution contract for 25 years after TDG were bought by ND last year. I haven't met with Justine Greening a couple of times this year, most recently last week in London, to discuss mode shift and fuel distribution.

Re: The Great Fuel Crisis of 2012 : Mon Apr 02, 2012 3:14 pm  

Man in Madrid wrote:

You've caught me out. I'm not "pretty close". I lied. I don't work for a retailer who sells >150 million litres of fuel each week. I wasn't involved in the decision making and re-tendering process of the largest secondary fuel distribution contract for 25 years after TDG were bought by ND last year. I haven't met with Justine Greening a couple of times this year, most recently last week in London, to discuss mode shift and fuel distribution.

Sounds like its all your fault then.

Burn him - has anyone got any petrol ?