Re: Kier Starmer : Mon Apr 19, 2021 9:48 pm  

He is just following the Johnson practice of making things up to back his failed argument. The strange thing is why would you start a thread questioning Keir telling a lie in Parliament which he apologised for when his hero Johnson lies at nearly every single PMQ’s and so far has not corrected his falsehoods once.
I have another question who dresses Johnson because during the one minute silence he looked like his suit came from the Worzel Gummidge range.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 6:55 am  

Scarlet Pimpernell wrote:

He is just following the Johnson practice of making things up to back his failed argument. The strange thing is why would you start a thread questioning Keir telling a lie in Parliament which he apologised for when his hero Johnson lies at nearly every single PMQ’s and so far has not corrected his falsehoods once.
I have another question who dresses Johnson because during the one minute silence he looked like his suit came from the Worzel Gummidge range.

I assume you wear suits from the Worzel Gummidge range yourself? how else would you become such an expert

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:04 am  

When elected officials start telling the electorate "I don't need a lecture from you" then something is very wrong. Same with Boris in the pub walking between tables - these people have lost all touch with ordinary people.

When Starmer says his wife works in the NHS you would think she was on the front - like the generals in the battle she is so far from the front line as it is possible to get.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 8:26 am  

At least Starmer stood up to the co owner whose objection was because he thought the word opposition meant they had to disagree with everything the Government do. I believe he thought it just killed old people so why did his business need to close. He is a classic pandemic denier and his selfishness would make an actual ideal Tory voter. I wonder if Johnson would have done the same or would he just hide in a fridge.
With regards the suit that must be one of the most stupid posts even for you. I have worn suits but you only need to see how he looked to come to the conclusion regarding his clothes and I didn’t mention his hair. I remember the grief Foot had to endure from the press and not a word about Johnson.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:30 am  

Scarlet Pimpernell wrote:

At least Starmer stood up to the co owner whose objection was because he thought the word opposition meant they had to disagree with everything the Government do. I believe he thought it just killed old people so why did his business need to close. He is a classic pandemic denier and his selfishness would make an actual ideal Tory voter. I wonder if Johnson would have done the same or would he just hide in a fridge.
With regards the suit that must be one of the most stupid posts even for you. I have worn suits but you only need to see how he looked to come to the conclusion regarding his clothes and I didn’t mention his hair. I remember the grief Foot had to endure from the press and not a word about Johnson.

Do you genuinely think Labour have provided robust opposition to what has been a catastrophic handling of Covid by the government - vaccine apart. I think the landlord was not in favour of lockdowns and he is not alone in that.

The central question for me is this - did lockdown save or cost more lives i.e. how many more would have died and how many more will die because of the lockdowns.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 9:57 am  

Labour pointed out the many times Johnson was slow to do anything which resulted in unnecessary deaths. When it comes to the application of lockdowns Labour backed them because they believed they work. What do you want them to do and they have also been strong advocates of stricter border controls because they were needed at this moment but once again Johnson did nothing.
I guess you run a business, the lockdowns were indeed longer than they should have been but that was down to Johnson’s dithering, a trait he is well known for. It should be the government you support that need to be asked why we are where we are with deaths etc.and the impact on all types of business. It’s a pity you don’t know a Tory MP or you could maybe have gained privileged access to the various contracts or loans they were dishing out.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 11:44 am  

I think Labour wanted longer and tougher lockdowns especially a circuit breaker. They tried that in Wales - didn't work very did it?

What I wanted from the opposition was a challenge in how we could get the NHS to best serve the population not how could the population best serve the NHS. I would have liked Labour to suggest how we could have kept our schools open not extend the closure further which is what they wanted.

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:41 pm  

The Ghost of '99 wrote:

The great problem for Labour is the loss of those safe seats in Scotland where there is a permanent majority of left wing voters who are voting for an alternative party which, whilst left wing, is essentially also identity based.

A similar pattern is affecting them in England where the Tories are morphing into a grievance-based white identity party with flexible ideology. That leaves them with quite a strong coalition as, despite this alienating younger people and some professionals, they've retained enough of their existing base to make it work for them electorally.

w
Surely the great problem for labour is the lost northern heartlands due to its attempts to deny Brexit and filling its front benches with morons and then electing the architect of its brexit policy as leader leaving its core support from plastic socialists called Tabitha and Tarquin and washed up socialists from the north who are still living in the 70s

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 12:50 pm  

Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:

Do you genuinely think Labour have provided robust opposition to what has been a catastrophic handling of Covid by the government - vaccine apart.

The Tories have an 80 seat majority and you want Labour to provide robust opposition??? That's like asking someone to hold back a leaking dam with sellotape. I'm guessing you're one of the ones who wanted a Tory landslide in December 2019? Well, you got one. Enjoy it.

[Mild Rover]

Re: Kier Starmer : Tue Apr 20, 2021 5:08 pm  

I like the way that the wind-up OP has been subverted to become an intelligent discussion.

Labour does seem to be stuck oscillating every decade or so between its socialist and liberal-socialist democratic wings, in a political era that has little emphasis on economics.

The Johnsonian Conservatives have done well by changing in some fundamental ways but managing to retain most of their traditional support. It’ll be interesting to see whether there is any sort of war for the soul (don’t laugh!) of the Conservative party (a bit like the never-Trump Republicans in the US) in the future or whether it continues in its current direction.