Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 11:59 am  

DaveO wrote:

...What this shows is he clearly does not understand the concept of a universal benefit and does not know the difference between that and a welfare benefit. Getting the latter when you fall on hard times should not disqualify you from the former.

I think he knows the diefference all right, it just doesn't fit his dogma to see them as different.

But, hey, he's got a point ... those kids don't deserve to be helped, they shouldn't have chosen such lazy, feckless parents.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 12:54 pm  

The best quote I heard yesterday was from one Tory, "Some people will lose their homes, they'll just have to move to a neighbourhood they can afford won't they".

The Labour party has a lot to answer for. They should be ripping into this nonsense but instead have disappeared up their own rear end talking about public spending cuts they can't commit to reversing "if" they get elected in three years time (which they absolutely won't anyway - and frankly don't deserve to be on current showing). F******g idiots led by a f*****g idiot.
He's "Tuff" though, really, really "Tuff". I almost cried the day they elected Mr Ed as leader, a coalition government that should have lasted 18 months with anything like a decent opposition has gone on to preside over riots, condemnation over rediculous and costly NHS reform plans, "increased" f*****g borrowing, sent us plummeting towards recession again (as predicted), the usual Tory levels of unemployment, the worst press scandal in living memory and now a highly predictable -it's all the foooking poor's fault bashing of people on benefits while the c***s who caused all the problems award themselves billions in bonus's again. And still, Call Me Dave's comedy writers have him sh***tting all over Mr Ed at every PM's question time.

Time to swap Millibands, hire Jon Stewart's writers and start taking some of the polish off the turd that is David Cameron (apparantly you can Mr Sadowitz - he's the living proof).

[DaveO]

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 1:15 pm  

DHM wrote:

They should be ripping into this nonsense ......

They should be ripping into all sorts of nonsense such as this, the education and NHS "reforms". Outright opposition and a clear statement that Labour will re-create the NHS as a true public service would win them the election on its own. Would unpicking Lansey's work cost money? Undoubtedly but that would be money well spent.

Unfortunately they are too timid to state outright opposition to anything as they try to appear reasonable. Alistair Darling is being proved right over the economy with even the IMF warning austerity with no growth is too dangerous a path to follow. There are plenty of government policies that require outright opposition and that would not imply any fiscal irresponsibility.

Unfortunately swapping Millibands would not work because D Milliband is as much a closet Tory as Blair was and that is why his brother got the leadership of the party in the first place. I think people expected Ed to be a darn sight redder than he is over things like the NHS but apart form Andy Burnham saying what Lansely is doing is wrong (which it is) he is not saying he will reverse the reforms if he gets into office.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:04 pm  

DHM wrote:

The best quote I heard yesterday was from one Tory, "Some people will lose their homes, they'll just have to move to a neighbourhood they can afford won't they".

The Labour party has a lot to answer for. They should be ripping into this nonsense but instead have disappeared up their own rear end talking about public spending cuts they can't commit to reversing "if" they get elected in three years time (which they absolutely won't anyway - and frankly don't deserve to be on current showing). F******g idiots led by a f*****g idiot.
He's "Tuff" though, really, really "Tuff". I almost cried the day they elected Mr Ed as leader, a coalition government that should have lasted 18 months with anything like a decent opposition has gone on to preside over riots, condemnation over rediculous and costly NHS reform plans, "increased" f*****g borrowing, sent us plummeting towards recession again (as predicted), the usual Tory levels of unemployment, the worst press scandal in living memory and now a highly predictable -it's all the foooking poor's fault bashing of people on benefits while the c***s who caused all the problems award themselves billions in bonus's again. And still, Call Me Dave's comedy writers have him sh***tting all over Mr Ed at every PM's question time.

Time to swap Millibands, hire Jon Stewart's writers and start taking some of the polish off the turd that is David Cameron (apparantly you can Mr Sadowitz - he's the living proof).

That well know peddlar of insanity, The Guardian, had an article this morning likening Cameron's government / times / potential fate to Ted Heath's. Tellingly though, it ended by saying that Cameron can be thankful he doesn't have to face Harold Wilson in The Commons.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:11 pm  

The problem with your analysis DHM is that although Labour need a new leader because they elected a clown they also need a fundamental change in policy direction. The other brother would not give that. The time is right for a really radical left-wing stance to be taken that starts off by absolutely and utterly rubbishing in an illectually sound way Thatchersim, New Labour and the coalition. Is that likely to happen? No chance with the current PLP in office.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:17 pm  

Dally wrote:

The problem with your analysis DHM is that although Labour need a new leader because they elected a clown they also need a fundamental change in policy direction. The other brother would not give that. The time is right for a really radical left-wing stance to be taken that starts off by absolutely and utterly rubbishing in an illectually sound way Thatchersim, New Labour and the coalition. Is that likely to happen? No chance with the current PLP in office.

I have read this post three times ... and I still (almost) agree with it.
I must have strayed into an alternate universe.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 2:44 pm  

El Barbudo wrote:

I have read this post three times ... and I still (almost) agree with it.
I must have strayed into an alternate universe.

If you put a 1000 monkeys in a room with a 1000 typwriters....etc......etc.....?

I mostly agree with it as well, although I don't believe the British are ready for fundamental shifts to the left anymore. Blair realised this and we ended up with the lesser of two evils and we managed to get our hospitals and schools rebuilt. This is where David Milliband would have worked. I have always seen the radical left as uncompromising and self destructive - as well as being not particularly popular. Tony Benn, as revered as he seems to be now, was as potent a weapon in the Tory arsenal as Saatchi and Saatchi.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 3:45 pm  

Politics - Ideals diluted by necessity
Ed Miliband (he may be a really good bloke/ politician) will NEVER be prime minister.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 4:18 pm  

DHM wrote:

I mostly agree with it as well, although I don't believe the British are ready for fundamental shifts to the left anymore. .

The time is right for conviction politics. People are fed up with weasly politics. Someone who is willing to stand up, talk bluntly and follow it through would work now / in the very near future.

Labour need to start winning arguments. The Tories came up with the politics of envy. The time is ripe for destroying the "politics of greed and selfishness." Will they have the guts to try to win an argument on those grounds? Have they got the personnel to win any argument? Probably, no and no.

Re: Should Iain Duncan Smiths expenses be capped at £26k a y : Mon Jan 23, 2012 5:23 pm  

Dally wrote:

The Tories came up with the politics of envy. The time is ripe for destroying the "politics of greed and selfishness."

Replace both with the "politics of dancing" and the job's a good 'un